Buying at Auction

Which dealers and auction houses are included on your website?
This is determined by a combination of sellers of pieces of interest (to us) and a bit upon reputation (when possible). We do not include marketplace sales on this site, as we find they are often out of date, or duplicative with other watches that are directly available from dealers. However, this site does NOT filter specific watches (too many watches to try to do so, and I don’t have the expertise regardless). So will there be watches that are fakes, frankens, or simply represented as something other than what they are listed? Unfortunately, yes. And I won’t know which ones they are. If you are looking to learn more about the reputation of a particular seller, which you should always do before purchase, make sure to check out the largest watch forums, which offer a wealth of reviews and opinions. And even the most well-known sellers and auction house may, inadvertently or not, present a watch as other than it is. We wish we had transaction experience with tons of dealers that we could curate all those included here. Perhaps one day…perhaps. Editor’s note: would require us to win the MegaMillions/Powerball jackpot
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How dealers and auction houses source watches

Sure you can go it alone, but a wiser course might be to establish a relationship with a trusted dealer, particularly for more expensive pieces, and/or those where you need an expert’s eye.

To find pieces, dealers look in many of the same places you would on your own:
– eBay (I shudder to think how many saved searches they have),
– Chrono24, where private individuals in particular may have interesting pieces, and
– auctions worldwide.

If you have the ability to attend auctions, here you can get a firsthand look at dealers actively looking to purchase for clients or themselves. You might not know why a dealer is purchasing – sometimes it can be just to protect the price(s) of their existing inventory of the same/like pieces.

Beyond these “basics”, dealers have a number of advantages:
– will be contacted directly about pieces for sale by individuals (as well as other dealers) who may know of them from industry articles, social media, referrals, and so forth,
– may be a part of WhatsApp and other groups of dealers who regularly buy and sell pieces within their network,
– relationships with their existing clients looking to sell,
– “pickers” who find watches at estate sales, antique stores and the like, and
– retailers, who will see watches come in from an owner and then offer them out to a number of dealers, with the best offer winning the piece.

You CAN afford to buy a vintage watch at auction

We’ll make an assumption here and say “yes” (and we do appreciate that budgets wildly vary).

Christie’s, Philips, Sotheby’s, Antiquorum, Heritage… All the largest and most well-known houses have, virtually without exception, watches in their auctions with low estimates starting around $2,000 USD, and some without reserve (which means that the watch will sell, regardless of dollar amount, to the high bidder).

A great example of the range of prices at auction is a stainless steel Patek Phillipe 1518 that sold for over $11M USD at Phillips: The Geneva Watch Auction Four in November 2016, setting a new world record for a wristwatch.

The low estimate of the next lot? $2,000 USD.

Participating in watch auctions

If you haven’t participated in a watch auction, you should absolutely check one out. If you are in the vicinity of the auction and previews, it’s a great way to go hands-on with a large number of pieces. The largest houses often time their auctions to take place during the same week, so there is the benefit of bring able to attend multiple previews in a very short period of time. And hey, free biscotti, bottled water, and even hot dogs (thank you, Sotheby’s Spring 2024 auction!) if you go to the right ones. Major auction houses generally have auctions you can also participate in remotely, and a number have added online-only auctions. Some auction houses, generally smaller houses, offer online auctions only. For ease of reference, I’ve compiled a watch auction calendar with a focus on the larger houses.

One of the benefits of auctions is that you don’t have to be in the right place at just the right time when a watch is listed (such as on a forum, opening that email from watchPool24, that WhatsApp group), rather you have time to research the piece and consult with others before bidding, as well as the chance to see the watch in person during preview days, if applicable. The auction format can arguably provide a more level playing field. Plus, at least one other person values the watch at the same level you do, right? Ok, that might be up for debate depending on if the house has some of their buddies shill-bidding for them or the chandelier is in on the action…look around the room to spot!

Even if you aren’t going to buy, consign or appraise, the auction house specialists are there to help educate and support consumers. So go ahead, pick up the phone (or meet them in person), they want to talk! And you don’t have to ask about a particular watch, so don’t hesitate to reach out if you are simply interested in learning about the auction process. They work with people who have no knowledge of watches as well as seasoned collectors, so you shouldn’t be put-off from calling.

In terms of how to bid, the best options are, in order:
– In person. See the pieces you are bidding on, who else is bidding (and if they are the same shill bidders that the auctioneer calls on frequently to bump up prices). You also have the ability to ask the auctioneer to deviate from the bid increment. For example, if the bid is increasing in $500 increments, in the room you can ask if they will accept an increase of $250.
– By phone. For those that aren’t at the auction in person but still want to participate in real-time, you can bid via phone during the auction. With this option you have the benefit of bidding advice from the specialist at the auction house who can provide color for what is happening in the room if you aren’t there (of course, there are those that bid by phone while they are in the room, benefiting from perhaps remaining somewhat anonymous as well as having the specialist’s advice during the lot). As with being in the room, you have the ability to ask to deviate from the bid increment.
– Online. If the phone isn’t your thing, and you want to watch the auction, some houses have online platforms that work quite well. These auction houses may allow you to watch the auctioneer, and generally have very clear interfaces showing the current lot description and image(s), bid (in multiple currencies), bid increment, and so forth. Generally speaking, you cannot see the bidders in the room. Aside from the inability to modify the bid increment, additional downsides to online bidding are the risk of internet issues logging in to your account, losing your internet connection, or a lag that impacts your ability to bid.

Previously, the only way to bid at most major auctions in advance was through “written” advance bids. I put this at the bottom of the preferred ways to bid as there is the possibility that less scrupulous auction houses might magically “find” others collectors to bid against you and take you up higher than you would have had to bid otherwise. Though that should never happen, with a written bid you are giving the auction house the approval to push the bid up to your maximum. We are comfortable submitting advance bids with some auction houses, though this method may not be for everyone. This refers to the old school auction sheets where you would write in your maximum bid, as well as online advance bidding that is becoming more commonplace for auctions that are open for bidding in advance of the date of the live auction.

Basics of live auctions:
1. Everyone is welcome
You can attend auctions for the biggest auction houses in the world, no invitation required. There isn’t a cost, tickets aren’t required, and you don’t need to register for a paddle if you aren’t going to bid. Attire is varied, and ranges from jeans and sandals to suits.

2. Attend the preview days
In advance of most auctions there will be preview days, which you should attend if you are considering bidding, and even if not to get a great education. Again, no tickets are required.
Some houses also take selected pieces on the road for previews, so even if you don’t live where the auction is taking place, they may come to your town (provided you live in a large city or one where the house also has auctions…think Los Angeles, New York, Geneva, Hong Kong, London). Nothing compares to seeing the watches in person, and attending preview days are also a great way to meet other collectors, dealers, and auction house specialists who can help you sort through the lots.

Stroll on in, take a look at what is available, and then ask the assistants to pull some out of the display cases. Some pieces may catch your eye that didn’t from the online images (which are often awful) or printed catalog.

If you do NOT attend preview days, make sure to get lots of additional images and video of the watch for review.

3. Handling and inspecting the watches (on preview days)
Almost without exception, you can handle any of the lots at auction. Generally there is a sitting area near where the items are on displayed where you can take a seat and view the watches at your own pace, with loupes and condition reports available, and other collectors to meet. Don’t hesitate to grab the auction house specialists to ask for their help – that’s why they are there.

In most cases, you’ll write down lot numbers on a piece of paper, and assistants will then bring the lots to your table, where you will need to sign for each watch that you “check out”. The pieces may not come in any particular order, and will depend on what other collectors have requested the same pieces at the same time. It is considered polite to keep the number you request to a just handful at a time, and then have the assistant take the pieces away as soon as you are done, so others can view them. You can stay for as long as you like, and go through as many lots as desired, but it is somewhat frowned upon to go through dozens of lots with no intention of bidding in the auction.

If you want to test out any of the watch functions (testing alarms, setting dates, testing split-seconds, etc.), we recommend asking a specialist to help you. And you should do this for pieces of interest to confirm they function as expected. While there are people who will test the functions and complications on their own, you can’t go wrong with asking for assistance. And that way you are ensured of not causing any damage to the piece.

4. Check out the movements
You should always see the movements for watches you may bid upon, and the best way to handle this is to request pictures in advance. We recommend contacting the auction house with requests or questions on lots at least a week prior to make sure your request gets handled. Once things get closer to the auction, requests may slip through the cracks as things get increasingly hectic. You can of course, see movements at the preview. If you are interested, we highly recommend you let a specialist open the case for you.

5. If you are bidding, pre-register
You can do this on auction day, but better to do in advance if you attend a preview day. One less thing to have to worry about the day of the auction. Especially if you are prone to oversleeping.

6. The day of the auction, know what watches you are interested in and your bidding threshold
Make sure to consider the Hammer and Premium, VAT/duties/taxes, and conversion rates.

7. Don’t make any sudden movements during the auction, or you may accidentally bid
Okay, that isn’t really true. You can, however, bid with your paddle (you need to have a paddle, regardless of whether you kick off bidding with it), with a motion of your hand, nod or your head, or whatever you have seen in the movies. If you are successful bidding, you’ll flash your paddle number so it can be recorded.

8. If you can, attend!
It’s a great way to meet others in the community, learn more about the interest in specific watches, see different bidding strategies in person, and find out who is bidding on pieces (assuming they are in the room – you can see the pieces of interest to specific collectors and dealers).

9. Paying for the watch
Auction houses may have different options for payment, generally due within 7 days for live auctions, though policies vary by auction house. The most flexible offer a cash option (up to some maximum amount, often on a calendar year basis), credit card (again, up to a limit…that is more than we can charge on our card anyway), personal check or wire. You will receive an invoice setting out the hammer price plus all other applicable charges, such as the buyer’s premium, local taxes, shipping expenses, loss and damage liability fees, and any other charges that may apply. If you are a successful bidder in an online-only auction, you will most likely pay from your online account via credit card.

Provided the watches are at the location of the auction, which most often they are, and you aren’t paying by a method that requires some number of days for funds to clear such as a personal check, you can take home your watch the day of the auction.

Actually, you can even pay and pick up a watch while the auction is still going on. Suck on that, competing bidders! *flashes watch just won*

How to bid at auction

I wish I could say that watch auctions are a nice safe place to bid.
My advice: do tons of homework in advance, see the piece in person, and set your limit.

Thoughts:
– Beware being the only bidder on a lot.
– Watches being handled during the previews can take a beating. Never hurts to see it on the last preview day, and also take video/images of the condition at the time.
– Know that you might be bidding against:
— The chandelier in the room (these are legal bid…the auctioneer can go up to the reserve amount making show of things, but none are real bids). Note at times you can bid *under* the reserve and win the watch.
— The owner of the watch. Yes…they might be there bidding against you to drive the price up.
— Dealers that own the same reference and want to protect their current inventory of pieces
— The manufacture, to either prop up the value of their pieces…while some may be bidding to purchase the piece (for their museum or otherwise)
— If you are bidding at an unscrupulous auction house, they may be driving up the price without bidders, either for a written bid you submit beforehand, or during the auction above the reserve (though not legal). Examples shared on The Waiting List featured one of the hosts talking about sitting in her car with a former Phillips’ employee as he was on the phone talking about what fake bids to put in the upcoming auction (Waiting List podcast, Episode #55 37:30 [1]), and likewise around the hosts skepticism over the phone lines not working for certain lots. The Waiting List a good listen as you rarely (never?) hear people talk publicly about auction houses in this manner. But the takeaway here is that some people would recommend *never* submitting an absentee bids, and may start at your bid, or shill bid up to your maximum.
— Those just looking to launder money. Yup.
– Pay attention to the catalog notes/symbols for the lot. For example, does the auction house have a direct financial interest in the lot, either in whole or part? Is there a 3rd party guarantee on the lot (and consider whether that shows a lack of confidence in the lot)? Is there no reserve?

[1] “In Hong Kong recently…I can say this since he’s not there anymore, he worked at Phillips, but he doesn’t work there anymore…he had to take a call for the auction that was happening that night and they were basically discussing which fake bids he had to put in.
And then suddenly it was silent and I think the guy on the other end was like ‘whose car are you in?’ and then the guy casually was like ‘I’m in Lung’s car…like, Lung Lung’s car’, but you know no matter what I’m still a potential customer, you can’t say that shit in front of me, right? Um, so he got off the phone and he’s like, ‘this does not leave the car.’
And I was like, yeah, okay, I don’t think I can bid from auction again. I don’t think I can buy from auction again, it’s so bad. But it was literally like, ‘what bid are you going to put it in, at what price, how many times are you going to do it?’…you already your client really well so you know what price he is going to put, so you just got to push him a little bit…”

Auction house Buyer’s Premium (BP)

So the gavel comes down and you’ve won the lot. Don’t forget that there is, usually, more to pay the auction house. In addition to applicable taxes and shipping fees, there is also the buyer’s premium. This premium is added to the hammer price of the lot, and may vary by the amount of the hammer fee (tiered, declining as the hammer increases), depending on auction house.

Rates listed below are based upon the highest (starting) buyer’s premium. The rates also assume online bidding as some auction houses add additional fees if you bid online, as crazy as that sounds.

These rates are subject to change. Please confirm with the auction house before bidding.
Please let me know if you see any updates required.

Buyer’s Premiums, from high to low:

Auction houses to check out

Virtually every auction house has sold franken vintage pieces, knowingly or not. That’s just how it goes. But this doesn’t mean that we avoid auctions (check out our watch auction calendar for upcoming events.

A short list of auction houses to check out, in alphabetical order:

If you are new to auctions, one great way to dip your toe in the water is to watch an auction that is streamed live with video. It’s not the same as being there is person, but can provide a fun and interesting introduction from the comfort of your cubicle (well, perhaps home).

There are new players in the world of auctions, and these can be worth checking out also. Of course, you may have a rough experience as they get the kinks worked out. And not all survive.

What may come as a surprise to you (it did to me when first diving into collecting) is that buying from an auction house doesn’t guarantee originality or truth. You may have to look past the flashy marketing material and big auction numbers, or years in business and industry praise. Some houses will withdraw pieces when evidence is presented if authenticity is questionable (or just plain wrong), some won’t.

What’s the difference between auction houses?

Not all auction houses are created equal. Below are similarities and differences of some of the largest.

Similarities across auction houses:

  • Bidding is available via a number of methods: in room, absentee, phone, online (website or via mobile app; may be through a third party aggregator).
  • Authenticity warranty applies to only a portion of the text for a lot. For example, only uppercase words in the first line of the catalog description. That’s right…everything else in the description is not warrantied.
  • Will indicate if from the original owner (or descendant), or if this is the first time offered in public.
  • Auction catalogs should provide detail, via symbols, as to whether the house has a financial interest in the lot (and if so, if a they have received funding support via another party), if they own in whole or in part, if there is a minimum price guarantee, if a third party has provided a financial guarantee, and if where is any material from endangered/protected species (for the straps), which will result in import restrictions. Some auction houses will note if a lot has no reserve.
  • Bidding increments (the increase in amount between bids) increases as the bid increases. While there are general ranges for bid increments, say $1k for bids between $10k and $20k, the auctioneer has the discretion to vary the bid increment at any time.
  • Buyer’s premiums start in the 20-25% range for the least expensive lots. Some smaller auction houses, more so those that use third party auction platforms, have even higher starting premiums, so be sure to check these when you are bidding. As an example, if you just won your favorite piece with a hammer of $1,000, you would be forking over $1,250 if there is a 25% buyer’s premium. Don’t forget subject to state taxes, and shipping or service costs. For international purchases, beware import taxes as well.
  • Auction houses will generally not offer only wristwatches, but also an assortment of pocket watches, desk clocks, pendant clocks, and even grandfather clocks. Depending on the auction house and location of the auction, what is offered may have a different focus, by either manufacturer, type or timepiece and/or manufacture date.
  • Payment can be via wire, credit card (may have a limit), cash (up to a certain limit per year), bank checks, and checks.
  • Employees can bid on pieces.
  • The auction house customer is the consignor, not the buyer.

While any particular auction can be skewed in terms of what is offered if there is an individual that is selling a number of pieces, here is a comparison for New York Watch Week (December 2018):

Some high-level comments:

Bonhams/Skinner

  • Will have a wide range of types of lots, not limited to wristwatches, but often a large number of clocks

Christie’s

  • Pieces ranging across years of manufacture
  • Most vintage pieces available among the major auction houses
  • From my experience, the most vintage pieces from original owners

Heritage

  • A completely different method of bidding. At Heritage, the opening bid is the reserve. Allow me to repeat that – IT IS THE RESERVE. So once a bid is placed, the watch will be sold. This is radically different from other auctions houses, where opening bids start below the reserve to encourage bidding, and you may be bidding simply against the reserve, or against the chandelier in the back of the room.
  • Bidding for auctions begins online prior to the day of auction. So Heritage, by the time the auction starts, has in effect sold all of the pieces that have bids.
  • “Service and handling” costs (even if you pick up the watch)

Phillips

  • Looking for a party? You’ve come to the right place! This auction house is an absolute marketing machine, and their auctions are more appropriately categorized as “Events”. The look and feel is completely different than the others – the dollars they put into the auctions, the setup of the space, the appearance of the bidders and also (ahem) the staff
  • Brightest and shiniest pieces
  • Focused on wristwatches – you won’t find the pocketwatches, clocks and other timepieces you will at other houses
  • Fewer original owner pieces than other major houses

Sotheby’s

  • Leans toward modern pieces
  • Large number of lots available
  • Can have clocks and some timepiece jewelry interspersed (though limited)
Auction house frankens and deception

The below examples of frankens are to make the point that you always need to do your own research, even when purchasing from well-known auction houses or dealers. I fully appreciate that auction houses have an incredibly difficult job in vetting every piece that comes in their door. And I don’t expect specialists at auction houses, or dealers, to have the depth of knowledge on every piece that you can find on forums. For specific pieces, absolutely, but it would be impossible for them to be as knowledgeable about every piece as the most knowledgeable community member (or group researching together) focused on that piece.

Eric Wind, in a Waiting List podcast, said he “see[s] a lot of bad watches pass through auction houses – as in, watches that have been altered, have very distinct restoration that maybe the auction house is not aware of, remember the expertise at the auction houses in my opinion is not always the best as they are constrained by compensation… Some people feel a false sense of security that if you buy an auction from a big auction house you are safe, but many times the most sophisticated restoration that is undisclosed happens in watches that go through auction… If you think you can go to this auction house and spend millions of dollars and I’ll be okay, it’s equivalent to having a sign on your back that says ‘Rip Me Off.'” (Waiting List podcast, Episode #55 20:15)

Swapped parts aren’t necessarily a bad thing, provided it is called out in the description of the piece. There can be some honest mistakes, but if you spend a lot of time reading watch descriptions, you’ll find that an inordinate amount of the time the seller and/or auction house description is clearly intentionally ambiguous or untruthful.

As examples I would recommend forum discussions around an Omega 2913 FAP, a fake Dayona “Solo”, fake Rolex papers, and following perezcope on instagram to learn what to watch for around Panerais (you may not be a Panerai collector, but it will open your eyes to the world of fakes).

What I believe is required listening for EVERYONE as perspectives of value:
– Dialed In, EP 34: What is The Cost of Truth?: King Flum (@kingflum on instagram)
– Dialed In, EP 20: The Dark Reality Behind the Watch Industry: Jose Pereztroika (@perezcope on instagram)

If you have additional examples beyond the below, feel free to drop me a line.

On with the examples of bad pieces and/or misleading descriptions (in alphabetical order).

Antiquorum:

Auctionata (no more):

Bonhams:

Christie’s:

Phillips:

Patrizzi (no more):

Sotheby’s: